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Expressing the letter "ñ"

In a message dated 5/25/2007 1:23:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
texmex@ writes:

    Buenos Dias Dr. Bill,

    My name is George Macias in English and Jorge Macías Azcárate in
Spanish.  My wife and I are new to Sign Language.  We're still "babies"
so to speak.  We started signing 6 months ago and we love it.

    My question is:  How would one sign the Spanish letter "ñ"?  That
letter appears in many forms in English text and does crossover to Sign
Language.  For example; the phenomenon call "El Niño" and the related
"La Niña."  We have a city in California named "Los Baños."  There are
many Spanish surnames that if spelled-out would require an "ñ" like
Nuñez, Ibañez, etc.

    Please share your thoughts on this subject.

George,
I don't know the sign for ñ. But why don't you try asking a contact of
mine down in Mexico:
Robin DeLaRosa
Apartado 640
Cabo San Lucas, BCS
CP 23450     Mexico
jsfreaky@
Robin knows MSL and some native MSL users who might have a sign you could use. If you find out a good sign for ñ, please do let me know.
Cordially,
Bill Vicars

From: "Jorge Macias" <texmex@>
To: <jsfreaky@>
Cc: <billvicars@>
Subject: The Spanish "ñ"
Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 20:48:18 -0700

Estimado Señor De La Rosa,

Estoy en busca de un solución a lo que ha surgido aquí en California
debido a que más y más Latinos estamos aprediendo "American Sign
Language."  El suscrito explica lo que busco.  Por favor contesteme con
su opinión.  Se lo agradeceré.

Jorge Macías Azcárate
(916) 212-8520

----- Original Message -----
From: <robindelarosa@>
To: <texmex@>
Cc: <jsfreaky@>; <billvicars@>
Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: The Spanish "ñ"


Saludos de Tejas Señor Macias y Señor Vicars,

Voy a escribir en inglés, el lenguaje común de todos.  Espero que
estará bien.

Throughout Baja California, Mexico the "ñ" (tilde n) is signed by ASL
users with the MSL/LSM sign.  The LSM sign is typically used for any
letter or accented letter specific to the Spanish language.  Attached
is a two page PDF document of the LSM alphabet.

The LSM "n" is the same as the ASL "n" although it is more common to
see the index and middle fingers pointing straight forward/out in LSM.
To sign "ñ", make the ASL sign for the letter "n" and while
maintaining that sign you would draw the "~" (tilde) with your index
and middle finger.

Accented letters/vowels are signed in ASL (which the ASL & LSM vowels
are the virtually the same...I have seen "y" signed slightly different
at times but I don't believe it is ever accented in Spanish) with a
turn/flick of the wrist.  The turn/flick is almost the same motion as
with the tilde but without the rolling motion as if you were trying to
remove something from your hand.

I hope this is helpful.  Another avenue of information would be the
Riverside School for the Deaf in California.  I remember meeting a
teacher from there that knew some Spanish that I believe was taught
there at the school.  In any case, if you see something different, I
would appreciate your sharing of the information.  If you have any
questions, please feel free to contact me at any time.

Best Wishes,

Robin DeLaRosa
4148 Shadow Gables Drive
Dallas, TX  75287
972.248.8575
jsfreaky@

p.s. Bill, as you can see have moved to Texas.  I hope to start the
interpreters program at Collin County Community College in the fall.
We will be here for approximately five years (my husband is working on
his masters).    We hope to return to Mexico when he is finished.


In a message dated 6/11/2007 4:13:12 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, texmex@ writes:
Hello Bill,

Well, here's the answer to my what is the sign for the "ñ" question.  Now,
what should be done with the information.  May I be so bold as to recommend
that you add the "ñ" to your web site?  You might start with the words "el
niño" and "la niña."  Let me know what you think, OK?

George Macias
212-8520

George,
I'll post a page for the letter: ñ
and list this discussion on it.
Cordially,
Bill


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